“Though hard to admit, you don't have all of the answers or the expertise in-house. Whether change or crisis, the leader should fit comfortably in the driver's seat. The biggest decision to make is whether you are committed to engaging the objective support you need.” - CRAIG NEAL® THE COLLABORATOR®

This week on The Digital Download we'll have a special guest, CRAIG NEAL® THE COLLABORATOR®.

We’ll hear insights from his trademark approach: CHANGE YOUR CONDITION TO CHANGE YOUR POSITION®

An accomplished Strategist, Executive Coach & Positioning Specialist, Craig Neal® The Collaborator® works with executives and their people to manage organizational change.

Following up on our recent episode where we learned about the polycrisis, this week we’ll talk about –

* The types of changes and crises business leaders are facing today,
* The ways leaders are (or are not) facing these challenges,
* The commitments leaders need to make, and
* Steps leaders can take

We strive to make The Digital Download an interactive experience. Audience participation is highly encouraged!

Transcript of The Digital Download 2023-02-10
Leading Through Change or Crisis,
with special guest Craig Neal - The Collaborator®

(00:01) [Laughter] very good very good fantastic good morning all and welcome go for it Rob today on the digital download we are going to talk about leading through change or crisis this is really following up on a recent digital download where we were talking about polycrisis but more on that in a moment first let's have today's panelists introduce themselves Adam would you would you please start us off with pleasure hi I'm Adam Gray I'm co-founder of DLA Ignite and I'm delighted to be here with such a

(00:52) thrilling bunch of people hello everyone I'm Jordan Abbott B2B social influence and interaction advisor at Supero proud DLA Ignite partner and if you couldn't tell Alex's son first time panelist on the show so everyone please welcome hey all right thank you Alex hello everyone so Alex Abbott founder of Supero and also very proud partner of DLA Ignite Tim hi I'm Tim Hughes I'm the CEO and co-founder of DLA Ignite and I'm thrilled to be on the Jordan Abbott Show excellent Tracy this is your first appearance on

(01:49) the Jordan Abbott show would you please introduce yourself I'm so excited to be on the Jordan Abbott show my name is Tracy Borreson, Founder of TLB Coaching & Events the Canadian representative on the panel today and I'm also a proud partner of DLA ignite excellent and myself I'm Rob Durant founder of Flywheel Results we are based in the Boston Massachusetts area here on the east coast of USA and yet another proud partner of DLA Ignite so today we have a very special guest Craig Neal - The Collaborator®.

(02:36) Adam is he here in the green room he is and actually here he comes now welcome bike ride hey everyone good morning Greg good morning and good afternoon to my friends over the UK that's right so to give our audience a little bit of background and insight Craig works with Executives and their teams to manage organizational change but rather than me telling everyone Craig would you please take a moment to introduce yourself well absolutely thank you Rob and again thank you guys for having me on this is you know exciting I I'm used to

(03:17) like one-on-one you know this is great because we have you know a plethora of different perspectives you know and different opinions you know by Dent we're all unique and that's kind of like the angle in which I approach things right so I'm known as The Collaborator® and that's what I do I collaborate with leaders and they're people to enhance Collective performance but I do that looking at each individual player and their uniqueness because the sum makes up the distinction and so you

(03:50) know my whole bag is you know of course strategy organizational development process Improvement and culture of course but one thing that most fail to do is really focus on positioning and you do that with identifying what makes you different and so my crusade if you will and I've shared this a couple of times is I guess against or defending my clients against commoditization right so no one's safe from it you know whether you provide you know a service or you know of course develop a

(04:27) product you know a lawyer looks like a lawyer a doctor looks like a doctor a you know salesperson looks like a sales person because we've been you know of course trained to think that way and instead of focusing on you know competing perhaps focusing on standing out and you know I guess that's my that's my brief if you will nice excellent so I have a whole list of questions that I prepared for you coming out as do I am I've got a quick question for you on that very Point Craig a lot of what we do is encouraging

(05:08) the individuals that we work with within the corporate framework to be themselves because we always say to people you are your only USP so you have to lead with who you are now I think that a lot of the challenge that organizations have and subsequently the people within the organizations is that they fail to see these days what is a matter of hygiene and what is a USP or a differentiator so they typically will say things like we are top quartile or we are market leader or we are extremely customer focused or we are

(05:47) and it's just not buzzwords yeah so how do you when you're working with people to help them realize how they can be viewed as something which is a commodity how do you break through that that barrier that they've put up where they genuinely believe that because they have 10 happy customers that makes them customer focused and that's a point of differentiation how do you kind of slap them around the face so they go oh my God I see what you mean now how do you get that aha moment okay you know what

(06:21) you I love the way you as a presented that question Adam and it's but Craig you don't have to slap customers around face it's all right isn't it no no no no no no no no no I knew you guys would be cracking me up yeah that's just an atom thing that's laughing yeah you don't have to do that and Rob guided me you know through the process of getting out with you guys so I guess I'm always prepared so again you know as I shared you know in the opening you know I collaborate with

(06:55) leaders and their people so I'm not the you know Specialists or expert that just sits in the c-suite and he runs out to the production line to get some juice and bring it back and say hey guys I've Got This brilliant idea you know I speak to each and every one of the players you know of course barring you know a you know international travel or you know 25 sites but while I'm there you know I have an opportunity to really use my best weapon and it's here So I listened to them I observe you know

(07:36) observation research is kind of you know Fallen by the you know Wayside you know in a lot of cases right so no one has the time or at least they believe that but you know fortunately I do you know and I utilize my time you know to really get to understand how people walk talk and feel so listening and not you know just on the surface level but really thinking about the individual now I'm not a life coach right so you know we'll exclude that I'm not a coach at that I can coach but more so I'm a great

(08:13) advisor and more importantly a listener and so when I hear these things when I see the interactions most of my engagements they're you know saying things like you know oh you know everything's fine or you know it couldn't be better which is the farce you know there's no substitute for better that's a plug for another one of my trademarks however to answer your question Adam it's really exposing them to what I call options right so if I'm breathing you know the same air if I'm surrounded by all the

(08:50) happenings of my normal day I'm going to believe that this is it you know I can't move forward you know there's nothing else out there so when they're exposed it's kind of like having I guess I wouldn't say a best friend but someone who you know like myself is very objective take the time without judging without preconceived you know expectation getting in and not walking you through but walking that walk with you so I like to say you know you know a business coach you know

(09:28) we'll share some you know ways for you to develop your repertoire you know whether it's you know time management you know of course self-development so forth and so on and then you know hey grasshopper you're ready to go a consultant you know a business consultant you know most of them you know will in in most cases work independently and they'll take care of the task or the project and say all right go ahead go implement it you know here's my report what I do I roll up my sleeves and I say

(09:57) let's do it together and that's been an effective way for me to not only encourage that leader who ultimately makes the decision to move forward was smart enough to bring me in it gives that it helps add that encouragement to really stick with the process right because I know that Craig isn't just here to you know wow me and share information that I can readily get on the internet he's actually listening to me and helping me not become a better Craig but become a better me so I hope I answered that okay Adam

(10:31) can I can I just add on to something because I love what you're touching on their Craig about like having someone else who can see your secret sauce right because I feel like one of the things that internally most people do is that we think the things that we're awesome at are just things there's things that everybody's awesome at and when you bring in that third party who knows what is unique about your awesomeness and can show you that can reflect that back to you it really is powerful and then being

(11:05) able to take that and build strategy and things on it I think it's one of the reasons why I think it's valuable to have an outside source to come in and be able to see that because all teams get this like you get going on your daily tasks and then it's just like your life you mention that right and having someone point that out to you and be like you know that not everyone does this right I think that that's I think a lot of companies can't see that on their own so it's awesome that

(11:35) isn't it yeah not everyone does that but then I'm blocking that that the my focus on ensure that they're distinctive right so not everyone does this but you know so we focus a lot on you know weaknesses right but strengths are what we should really you know be mindful of right how can I how can I help you become better right again you know there's no substitute for better another Shameless plug however I think you know for myself and how I present I guess my package right so I only work

(12:13) with you know three to five clients in a calendar year and I do that intentionally right so there's the availability I'm always accessible for my clients so they can just tap in you know to my smarts or perhaps get me involved in things that they're doing I don't have to think of you know 25 you know let me pick one 25 Jordans right that I have to recall some conversations or things we've gone through because I'm not chasing after closing and sealing accounts I'm

(12:46) chasing after the results right I want to help them become better I get paid you know based off of my contributions to you know getting those results so I'm not focused on hey how much money can I get you know that that's I will leave that to some of their team members what I'm focused on is okay am I going to provide value in this engagement and is it lasting value and you know with everyone wanting to be a coach a consultant and you know they say they can do this the person who you know the cobbler now is calling

(13:18) themselves a foot consultant and you know so forth and so on right so the name and the buzz comes around my distinction was if you happen to have expertise in multiple areas which we all do right and I'm glad your voice is back to normal there Adam sounds like it after that flew and I love your guitars by the way thank you very kind a lot of folks don't really recognize indeed they don't recognize you know the talents that they have or they're thinking multitasking you don't have to multitask to be

(13:57) effective but it's great to have reference to those you know tools within your box you know and you know the experiences that you have for myself you know I cover a wide array of you know expertise and I'm not talking about hey you know I dive into this and I play around with this you know I take it very serious I spend a lot of my time researching and of course developing on my own have I worked with other consultants and coaches absolutely I think it's great but moreover being able to identify

(14:32) the challenge not by using best practices from elsewhere but what's going on here so I always approach you know at the start of an engagement I come in with an open mind I don't listen to my clients arbitrary you know thoughts on you know what the root cause is I explore that with them and you know in a lot of cases very objectively so I'll give you an example so when I'm engaged the champion for or you know my client will say okay well hey you know let's go ahead and take a look at the plan for

(15:16) example hey John you know here's Craig you know he's going to work with us for you know a few months and you know get things moving around here right so naturally John is expecting me to you know have that top hat and walk around the plant for a series of days add some bunch of probing you know questions and you know gathered my intelligence and I'll you know return the next day well oftentimes I'll leave John alone because I know naturally he's you know he's going to show me the best of the best and show you know

(15:54) that he's you know efficient right because he knows I'm In Cahoots with the boss so I call that my Second Impressions Theory and I do that even with engagements when I meet people out and about right first impression of course I want you to like me you want me to like you so I'm you know we're going to talk all the fluff talk and you know we're best friends and hey you know what you know here scan my LinkedIn barcode or QR code this is a digital download my bad I'm going I'm going back I'm sorry guys

(16:25) you know go ahead and scan it all right great we're friends and if I you know if we're gonna have a meeting after that you know I would hope that it would be you know rapid because I purge about 30 every month I mean roughly about 400 people each month and you know we may connect but when we play you know to the LinkedIn as like Facebook or you know just the show that we have you know a thousand connections you know with no substance it's like never mind so I kind of keep it Slim So if you guys have taken a look at my

(16:59) profile you're like what's this 300 what oh wow okay well I wonder I wonder if he likes people well I do but I'm very guarded because there's a lot of secrecy in what I do as well and I don't want you know my clients or some of my connections being attacked but back to that Second Impressions Theory so I say on track so we'll meet and we'll have a cup of coffee or we'll have a virtual whatever My Hope or more importantly what I'm looking for is consistency as we've you know kind of shedded

(17:34) some of the barriers that you know the you know networking event or whatever you know the trade Association Gathering we feel comfortable with one another which kind of takes off the pressure and the route more than likely going to expose who we truly are right consistency if you were a jerk please be a jerk when I meet you that second let me with you the second time okay I have some jerk friends too so I'll hang out with them when I feel jerk you know but if you are you know playing nicely in jerky right there you know there's an

(18:08) imbalance and I also challenge people to hold me to that right I want to always be authentic I'm a human being as well so that applies to not only having connections and meeting new people but it applies to the work that I do you know for some reason I always remain objective my brother who is a technical he's a technical writer for intellectual property he had mentioned you know Craig you know this is funny you always stay on brand and I said you know it's just the right thing to do who are you know

(18:42) are we are we you know putting up this you know facade online because we have tools to become you know creators it's great it's awesome but with everyone having the ability to do it you shape the narrative to you know what suits you but oftentimes you know we're looking at it from you know a micro lens and I guess I'm going on about a lot of stuff but I believe you know relative to it Craig I wanted to scratch that a little bit more Tracy I found it interesting that you picked up on people don't see themselves as unique

(19:18) because when Craig was first talking about that I went the exact opposite where people think they are unique and really they just look like every other lawyer every other doctor I like Rob Turrell’s comment discovering the uniqueness of a person or the secret sauce of a business is not as easy as it's an excuse me a bundle of experiences and ingredients so help us dig into that a little bit more how do you help them bring out that uniqueness and how do you as Adam told us slap them in the face when they think

(19:59) they're being unique and they're just really not all right well let me jump back on to I guess you know the full name right I'm Craig Neal - The Collaborator® and as you all know the collapse collaborator or collaboration means that we you know you have somewhat side by side with you or focused on the same goals right so that all begins when we establish trust that Second Impressions theory that I shared with you know it's kind of it's kind of like my quick trust building you know

(20:32) it's exercise right from the get I say you know you know before we talk about anything it's important for us to establish trust I don't move forward after that and I you know I share this with my clients and you know oftentimes people that I engage with so trust is always tested right so as people we're going to kind of throw some curveballs here you know that I believe we're very Dynamic so it's not just like okay yeah whatever you say Craig yeah it doesn't work that way but as we're uh

(21:07) convening and we have you know several interactions we start to develop or refine and strengthen that trust and so to answer your question rob you know that trusting relationship must continue throughout the process because there's in my walk oftentimes I find my clients kind of reverting back to what they're comfortable with right what they're used to you know for instance if you know you are [Music] if you're used to operating in the mode of aloofness in in the case of you know some

(21:53) Peter you're right I you know everything you know I really don't care that's your comfort zone right so when you're challenged it's easy to just revert back to that and when I when I returned you know back outside like hey you know what happened Mary you know you were you were on fire I'm able to let me ignite what reignite that you know that that focus on where we were going change your condition to change your position right so that's what we've been throwing out

(22:30) it's my trademark approach it's not a methodology because I think you know every methodology doesn't work for every person they're unique but the goal is to change your condition we have this condition I don't know what you know you don't know what mine is I don't know what everyone else's is but it's something that's most likely holding you back from reaching that position so I like to focus on okay what is the challenge you know not what your weaknesses are

(23:01) but the challenge really in the mindset and so trust enables us to move forward trust enables me to work with my client to get to that destination so that's you know that's the most effective answer I can I can give as far as how I practice Yeah so we I've got a question for you Craig we a few weeks ago we were talking about the fact that 98 of CEOs have basically said that they're going to drive change with their business model it was either in the next year or the next three years

(23:44) and we kind of we did a poll with the audience and with the group to ask you know how many do we how many CEOs do we actually think will end up driving change and I think the average was about 20 if I'm not mistaken someone even said five percent what yeah I'm kind of about what you do in kind of the how do I how do I help a CEO yeah with the conclusion that he needs to change first then he hires you I guess but then obviously you've got this task of helping them to identify what they need to change when you work with

(24:26) them ride hey you know very pointed question there Alex because yeah I mean we don't know I have a process right so it's not like hey you have here's a check Craig come help me you know solve you know all the challenges of our organization it doesn't work that way so again you know we have that trust then there is an opportunity for us to sit down and talk about your objectives and looking more so globally when this point you know like I said I'm not a you know business coach right so uh

(25:01) and I cover a lot of areas but however my first focus is on the person who makes that decision right and yeah you know everyone's involved but moreover it's important to keep in mind that most CEOs most corporate executives like I said before have been trained to walk talk and think that way and I know you guys touch base on that as well right you know everyone is wanting to you know be like someone else and so you already you know typically in you know the beginning

(25:49) of some of that relationship building you will see some flexing of what I believe I'm supposed to do right it's breaking the barriers to find that individual right without all the mass and so when I had this conversation the other day where you know when you know you come in and you know you're having a conversation they say things like you know hey Craig you know you know have you ever worked with a you know a company our size have you have you worked within our industry before and you know mind

(26:25) you I'm industry agnostic right you know what they're really asking is hey can you help me you know remain at this quote that's what they're asking can you help us be just like we were but why am I here I thought you were looking at a change initiative right can you help me you know look like everyone else again like you know it's ridiculous so you know as I have these conversations and I'm sharing these little stories of notes you know I do this with my clients

(26:58) you know ultimately help them think differently one of the most effective ways that you know I do this is getting them out of their four wall Sanctuary right where it says whether you're remotely or whatever get them out of their environment introduce them to new people fresh perspectives and you know far away from their natural surroundings and having these conversations and really engaging with them on a trust basis right on you know that collaborative like I'm there with you we're working together right and

(27:34) everything that I'm able to do and produce is not me sweet it's us working together I wouldn't know what the challenge is unless you told me right and you know so how can I there's no tool or any you know Cape that I have to put on you know to be the star because it's not me my clients are the change agents they just need to realize that and those options or exposure you know to new things is helpful but yet there's only one you know collaborate yourself yeah so yeah along those lines

(28:08) collaborating two things first I want to invite the audience to bring in their questions what challenges are you facing what ways are you trying to get your leaders to change or any question that that you might have for really Greg or anyone on the panel second I know before we came on Jordan had started to share with us question he had so Jordan would you please share with us that question yeah sure so Craig I watched a number of your videos ahead of today so I really enjoyed them there was one that really stood out

(28:53) to me in which you were speaking about the risks or the impacts that commoditization will have on businesses and it brought two stats in particular to mind the first is Gartner’s findings that 72 of buyers prefer a rep free experience or to not have to interact with the rep at any point throughout a purchasing decision and then the second I believe it was a trust radius report that found that lack of transparency is one of the number one reasons for a buyer or a buying group to discount or not include a vendor

(29:38) in a review or the short list so I guess my question is that a sign of things to come that even the more complex purchasing decisions are becoming commoditized you know I thank you for checking out the video I do appreciate that Jordan and I've got a few out there you know that touch base on you know you know I don't consider myself a futurist but sometimes I think I think that way right you know who knows I don't know you know we're exposed to you know a lot of noise out there and

(30:13) you know some you know these stats you know pan out some don't right because I don't know everyone in the world and I don't know what they're thinking it's watching behaviors based off of you know our analytics right but as far as the future is concerned if there are still some true die-hard you know [Music] lovers of people which we are then I don't think we're going to let you know the shift to Ai and [Music] computer interaction stop us from collectively growing as a species

(30:58) and what I mean by that is anyone from you know I consider myself old school I'm only 43 but you know my mentality is always regardless of what you know comes you know to pass you know barring you know the Terminator effect you know we're still gonna need people we're gonna need people to program these machines we're going to still you know need to interact in some way or another you know what do people do you know hundreds of years ago right as we went into different you know revolutions

(31:29) you know we adapted and we found ways to utilize those tools more effectively I think just where we're at right now it's at we're in a funny place similar to that of music just mess with you Adam right you know every once in a while after Prince died you know that was the end of music for me but you know there were there were some artists that have come out and really you know you know they struck a note that was that drove us to really experience more than just digital music right

(32:02) experience you know the performance and you know the show we saw Boyz II Men last night and I was like wow they did a great job you know it was just three people but they put on a show what I'm getting at is that we always just as people have found a way to adapt to you know our surroundings with all the noise and the chatter out here and you know in most cases everyone's saying that they're you know their expertise is predicting the future you know we run into those Doom and Gloom you know type of situations

(32:39) if you looked at that video deeper Jordan I shared that the best way to defend against commoditization is you know really honing in and honoring you know the strength of The Company You Keep and that's your people right so if I engage with a leader I'm more I'm going to share with them practices and principles to keep it people focused right count on the people yes we have collaboration tools we have you know if we look at everyone's stack it's all the same stuff right even if you know I wouldn't had

(33:14) someone build a custom system for me a custom you know CRM or whatever it's still a template configured for me it's the same stuff and now I think I stand out because I have tools I think I stand out because you know the Grandeur of my name you know or you know my company's history you know moving away from understanding my best way and the best you know the most important way or effective way I could stand out is through the efficacy of my people and that's the you know Collective have you seen my I've seen I know you

(33:52) put the Mark's comment up Adam but it's a just wanted to bring that the biggest challenge I ever had with leaders in the offshore environment it just so you know Mark Works in in oil and gas he's talking about oil rigs so biggest challenge I ever had with leaders in the offshore environment was getting them to recognize that we had put them in a leadership role I got several together to review a job description and none of them actually recognize it as their own position that's priceless that's absolutely

(34:27) and by the way Mark also says that he met Boys to Men in a Vegas hotel Corridor two years ago and they were awesome and he agrees oh awesome Mark yeah oh man it was it was a great show my wife was instrumental in you know planning ahead I think she bought the tickets like you know three months prior but it's a great show and to your question mark unless someone else wants to share no oh please here all right well so every promotion should be strategic right it shouldn't be just based off of

(35:06) tenure or you know hey you know what Rob did a great job for us I'm not poking at you Rob just use the name Rob did a great job you know and you know you look at us you know we're doing great you know it's time for promotion that's not strategic thinking right you're thinking of the Long Haul but and if you're thinking of the law Hall you should be prepping and grooming that person to assume the new position the new role you know over a period of time don't do it you know if because of

(35:37) vacancy opened up and sometimes you know you really can't you know plan you know for you know a crisis or something that you know is urgent however if you know leaders or people who make these decisions aren't focused on developing that person right Beyond just the you know the short win or because they've been with us so long they're setting the organization up or at least that department up for failure so being able to recognize that you have assumed a new role is I mean it's important that

(36:21) the leaders who have made that decision have invested the time to acclimate you to what that role that what the role requires right and again you know I'm going to insert this you know and I move through these spaces so much you know everyone's focused on the title Bankers have you know the vice presidents and all that stuff it's really the role what role do you play in the grand scheme of things what is your role right when we eliminate titles and I'm not saying you do that we our titles are based off

(36:58) of you know communicating with other businesses oh well I'm the VP of HR oh you are too so we have like a directory or we can go on you know org and look at you know the organizational chart and say okay that's my target that's what I'm going for but they're all titles and unfortunately as great as we are as human beings the majority of us right get gassed up about our title right maybe a little bit of money you know came with that promotion or with that title and now I'm superior

(37:31) right and I'm focusing on being the boss based off of a title instead of being the person in charge based off of the role that I play leaders should not be micromanaging nor should they be mixed up in everything right you have expertise all around you what a leader should be doing you know is not only identifying what role they play but they should help others identify their respective roles and that's with interaction that's why it'll never die right there will always be business for me and I'm

(38:02) assuming all you guys right because we get so caught up into these systems of not only thinking but operating based off of Old you know metrics and you know what everyone else said that we're supposed to do so quick what I heard you say was for somebody to have career advancement that should be prepared in advance correct that's ideal in my experience not only does that not happen but once they're in that role it very often doesn't happen that is Career Development especially in my world I see

(38:43) it where sales people are promoted from the front line sales to the top performer of course becomes the next sales manager they don't know how to manage they don't know how to hire they know how to sell and it's just presumed that because they were so good at this they'll be equally great at everything well I want to ask the rest on the panel have you experienced anything like that in in other Industries in other rooms Alex I see you shaking your head yes yeah well it was me yeah I've seen that happen in the tech

(39:28) industry too is that you get somebody who's like a super good developer and then you make them the VP of development and then all of a sudden and just assume that they're gonna be good at all those other things and you're right the one thing I had for the two years that I was really transitioning from sales rep to sales leader was a strong mentor and without him I would have surely failed yeah so it happens a lot it happens a lot and I think that a lot of companies I work for a company where they were

(40:06) constantly being taken to Tribunal and losing because of the fact that they were they had in they had managers and leaders who didn't really know how to manage a lead and it was in it was at that point when they started investing in training because it was cheaper to buy expensive training was it than it was to keep losing a Tribunal we have different you know our employment laws are quite significantly different to the ones in in the US especially around discrimination and stuff like that

(40:39) so it was costing them a fortune yeah and you know I'll add to that too what you were sharing some you know and a lot of training and you know things of that nature they're supposedly proven to be effective right but I believe that everything is situational and Alex says you shared you had a mentor right that helped guide you through that means that they actually were you know you were prepared I think it's laziness on behalf of leadership if they don't focus on those

(41:27) things like oh wow you know as and let's go ahead and promote this person because they did so well you know for us in this capacity without truly identifying you know whether or not they have the goods I'm you know of course with you know some discretion you know I'm not actively going through that right now you know I asked my client the other day I said do you think that this person is ready you know and the majority of the things that you know were shared told me again that he wasn't sure

(41:59) if that person was ready okay so often what the issue is the people their belief is that the only way they get career and Hunt advancement is by moving into management yeah with Tim and I and Alex all worked at the same company if you were an independent contributor there was a limit to your power within the business you know you needed to be a manager of a team or a manager of managers of teams or a manager of managers of managers of teams and that's the only way that you could Advance within the organization

(42:35) and the only people that achieved VP or SVP or RVP role as an independent contributor were people that came through acquisition that said if you want me in the company this is what I'll do and I don't want any of that stuff so it's really interesting that your contribution to the organization in most organizations isn't enough to get you the visibility and the plaudits that you deserve for Success what is a large team that report to you yeah let me jump in on that real quick Adam you know and so that's the

(43:20) other thing what our motivation you know it's intrinsic right what's driving us to want to you know move up in our career is it you know the power is it you know more money you know I just the natural progression that I'm supposed to have I know people who've worked you know you know a entry level you know or in a lower level position has been you know completely happy right and so you have a lot of folks and you know unfortunately a lot of young people thinking that hey you know this is

(43:50) the path that I should take and once I'm a manager you know or once I you know I get here I'll be able to you know purchase this or you know show off on Instagram you know how truly successful I am success isn't I don't consider success money right I think it's just the byproduct of doing a good job but I would assume the majority of us we like money we need money but that's not you know what drives us it's if I am if I do Ascend to this new role or this new position you know what are

(44:24) my motives why am I doing it you know and I think that's overlooked quite a bit as well so you have everyone vying for the top spot can't handle the top spot then they wonder why you know things aren't going well and why they haven't you know achieved success but we're inundated with a bunch of junk out here though you know everyone's telling you this is what you have to do even from my old school you know background is like keep your nose clean you know keep moving forward and one day you'll be

(44:53) president of the universe well that's not always true right but a lot of folks who believe that and they subscribe and buy into it and they operate in that mode and for myself and you know my clients you know I like to really dispel a lot of that junk you know so we have these conversations that are very intimate I'm not here okay I don't charge by the hour so you got me here we go you know let's get this going you know let's find out what it truly is and it's not you know within you know an eight-hour

(45:24) conversation it's over time and as you had a mentor Alex you know it's great when people you know actually invest in you enough to encourage you to invest in yourself I want to add something quickly there on me because Craig you talk a lot about collaboration right and when we are looking at like what's the role of a leader what's the role of an individual contributor and you can actually bring all of those together in a collaborative way without saying I think because at the end of the day one people want to do a good job

(45:59) people want to be able to show up and say that I did something today that was meaningful organization right and hopefully meaningful to me at the same time and also some people just don't want to manage people and that doesn't mean that they're not a valuable contributor and so when we eliminate those contributions because they aren't quote-unquote leaders they're missing out on a lot of really useful contribution that can make our company make the secret sauce of our company come to life so it's just it's something

(46:34) that I'm really passionate Lee opposed to is this concept of only managers get to contribute in decision making capacity because it doesn't make sense we'll hire a consultant and an external consultant to come in and give us an advice but we won't listen to the people who've worked at our company for 16 years who have knowledge about how we could fix this problem which drives me nuts and that's where Innovation comes from right so if you guys don't mind so Sally you know may have come up

(47:03) with a brilliant idea probably wasn't right for the time but it was dismissed or someone scoffed at you know even the thought Sally is going to lock up and not share that secret sauce if you will or that thing that'll help them raise the bar and get and stand out within their industry their sector or you know their neighborhood because they're often overlooked because of you know failed decisions like I said lazy earlier you know hey if you're not taking the time to really get to know your people and see if they're

(47:35) you know built for the role then shame on you that's just like downsizing you know you downsize because you guys messed up now everyone else has to suffer right you're supposed to rally the troops and I shared earlier you know so I cover strategy you know organizational development culture process Improvement and of course positioning right but I do that through a chain and so change your condition to change your position is the leadership Focus align your c-suite with Main Street is okay the you know the counterparts of

(48:08) you know the sea level or the or the den of cheeses I like to call it right they need to kind of be brought up to speed as well because they're mirroring the intentions and the behaviors of the leader because everyone aspires to get to that role so the sabotage backstabbing or you know misalignment is present once we have all those things in order right then I move down the channel and I talk about of course people I mean they're happening all at the same time right because instead of multitasking

(48:44) it's looking at the you know the global Pro you know progression you know of the organization not just hey someone hired you know me in to help them right because I can't help you can't help me and you can't help your people so culture lives within people another one of my trademark approaches right is focused on kind of bringing things back to the whole so I engage and interact with each and every person there right not asking them like I said probing questions so I can look good or

(49:15) really knowing hey why are you here you really understand your role right and so once we develop you know a recipe and again I'm keeping these things in mind change your condition to change your position if I get off of you know if I if I get off track or my client gets off the track because we're supposed to hold each other accountable all I have to do is mention that right oh yeah that right that's the focus it's not oh well this is step four and you know step nine of you know the process now let's get back on track culture

(49:46) lives within people you know line your c-suite with Main Street but that big thing that you know we talked about with innovation right so there's no substitute for better as I've plugged this is the third time now right how do we get better how do we raise that bar and raise that standard and once we do that we're better suited for positioning does it ideally happen you know in you know as expected no but we have people who have changed their mindsets their attitudes or their approaches towards

(50:17) the work that they do and you said it right you know people want to have autonomy or they want to have significance we all do all right we have a bunch of Talking Heads brains that did here we want to be known we want to be you know somewhat liked or feel as though we made an impact and oftentimes that opportunity is missed and that's why I absolutely love you know engaging with people and exploring you know what would that look like conceptually what would it look like if you know you were able to ascend

(50:50) to this role what would it look like if everyone in here wasn't a slacker so I digress I'll stop I'll stop right we've actually had a question here from Mark yes who says I asked Craig why his nicely lit shelves behind him have nothing on them so no trophies because I'm the I'm the show peace man the point that Rob Turrell and Andrew they're most recent comments they were spot on in terms of what I was driving at people promoted into positions that

(51:34) really have no I don't want to say right but ability to be there and it and it isn't often developed but I want to go back even earlier if you could Adam find Rob Turrell’s question because while he asked that earlier I think we've come back to that a couple of times now he's asking do you use just conversations but also other tools like personality feedback to build the picture of the individual or perhaps some of their social media how do we go about that what do we do to help understand their personality come

(52:15) back to that originality piece and tie it into further development of these individuals so I've always used Miles Briggs as a as a personality thing that's the one that I was taught when I did my management training I but Robertson I like collecting strengths and strengths is always great because it tells you strengths things that you can focus on developing instead of weaknesses and I think well I've done colors I've done the colors one as well which is and again it's really it's useful for

(52:55) understanding people because yes as Tracy says you understand strengths but you also understand people's weaknesses and then you can take that into account can I be the contrarian here guys yeah please do Craig we love that all right I've always thought you know and they're great tools I'm not knocking anything you know of course the Briggs is great I think that when people see their diet you know their diagnosis right or they're like oh wow that's me they follow it you know like a horoscope

(53:25) and they're spending more time wanting to be exactly those things and so you'll notice the shift in their personality or feeling you know enlightened to say wow you know I'm you know I'm you know a low C or whatever right and so when I engage with a lot of people I hear them you know you know share their results from you know a lot of those particular assessments and you know I say okay well let's just back it up let's really uncover what you are you know beyond the surface that's just

(53:58) my take on exercise with my class recently yeah they were coming into class and they were supposed to take a career personality assessment type of thing so they did that and came to class and here we are we're supposed to go over the results with them instead I gave them a completely different test a style awareness talking about their communication style and so on and then I shared with them that both of these were bogus tests because I could get you to change your answer and therefore change the outcome and I

(54:40) said to them any test where you do not get the same result every time is not scientifically valid now it is directionally accurate but simply because this career assessment said you should be it told me I should be a cinematographer mine told me I should be a dude Rancher which is to say that you know a lot of people see Performance Management reviews and any of these tests basically is it you're just trying to check up on me and then you're going to use it against me so you know you need to have a safe environment

(55:19) psychological safety so that's what I was telling you took this test of a job application what if you took this test as part of a Job review what if you took this test as a fun night out at the bar with a bunch of friends you're going to answer very differently about your communication style or your career desires or whatever the case may be based on what you think the right answer should be because we're more Dynamic we're more Dynamic Rob we're more than just like this singular you know uh

(56:00) personality feature or trait right you in different environments change how we respond you're absolutely head on that two very strong words put together I am right I am and anything after it all right and start to believe that you've got a registered trademark have you registered your name as a trademark my name my silhouette of my face and all of my trademarked approaches I'm very important very I'm very intentional about identifying The Source right I can understand you saying trademarking

(56:46) The Collaborator® because we look at trademarking and stuff when we first started the in the business but the fact that you've done your name, I just thought it was quite interesting yeah that that was that was important to me right and so there's well Rob you're in the U.

(57:02) S you're not too far Tracy and the rest of you there was a basketball player named Craig Newton all right it's a Christian rock star called Timothy Hughes yeah okay I'd love to hear some of his music sometime yeah I get a CD every year from my brother who always buys me from for Christmas and things yeah so you I mean you know right so it's like you have your McKinseys and you have all these you know big you know Consulting behemoths right the most powerful brand I've always subscribed to is your name

(57:39) right I want people to remember me as pregnant if they save The Collaborator® sure that's fine but at the end of the day you know my friends my family you know everyone knows me is Craig and so yeah it's important to identify the source and you know hey I share a lot of stuff and you know I share it freely I'm not asking anyone you know to you know subscribe or like or whatever I just like sharing different you know experiences that are important and it's nice to know you know where it

(58:11) comes from and just it's an in-joke Craig but Andrew basically said that that the digital download should have trademarks just do the thing something that Tracy basically that's a quote from her so and he's totally might challenge you on that right that'd be that'd be considering confusingly similar I believe that's the term for at least you know for U.

(58:43) S trademarks but you'll come up with some other ones if you need some help maybe I can you know share that too yeah thank you we have yeah Jack says they're Minefield they are Minefield yeah thus far I wish we could talk for you know you know another you know thank you so much for coming on Craig it is about woman absolutely thank you thank you Ross and thank you all for you know I have me on today thank you thank you for Craig and sharing your insights and expertise I really appreciate it thank you quick question Craig how can

(59:20) our audience learn more about you and connect with you or to use your term collaborate indeed thanks yeah so you can find me at craigneal.com c-r-a-i-g-n-e-a-l there's a way to contact me and then I guess socially it's at change condition am I supposed to add to the AD Sign yeah change conditions everywhere so feel free to thank you all right well Craig thank you so much for being here panelists of course always a pleasure audience again to the conversation all of us thank you thank you very much

(1:00:04) until next week yes, all right dude that's right goodbye everyone thanks.